Kahlt as a class is a joke now



  • Parry activates just as fast as Absorb, it just lingers longer and only defends certain directions.

    The animation is just slower, the parry begins before the player even raises his arms, the second the animation starts from what I've tested.
  • edited November 2017
    Ability start up times are the same.

    You can cast Parry just as fast as you can cast absorb, the difference is just Parry lingers longer.

    You can use parry out of light hitstun basically immediately. IMO its stoopid.

    EDIT : Didn't notice there were two pages and double posted lol sorry I'm a fucking moron ;^))
  • Interesting! Thanks for the break-down, that's good to know
  • Parry has a start-up time, but has waay more active frames to compensate. Hard to miss. Absorb and Avoid are similar in that they can be used more reactively. Difference being if you mess up an absorb you are eating that hit, where as avoid can be used as a pressuring dodge giving the stamina I wish absorb still did. The least they could do is give absorb more active frames considering you're basically just reducing (hopefully) the damage you take without much opportunity to punish or negate damage like the other two.

    tldr: make absorb great again - get rid of protection and give it some love either with stamina or active frames.
  • edited November 2017
    As for Kahlt's attack style and concept, Absorb should not JUST allow you to take hits; It should also let you store/channel the taken damage for a counter attack, making it as *"more damage you take, the more damage you will unleash to the opponent.* THAT should fit in the concept of Kahlt, doesn't it, which is supposed to be a slower tanky damage dealer?

    This way will let Kahlt players take advantage of Absorbing without making the class overpowered. For example, if your enemy knows that you're a Kahlt, they probably stop spamming moves because that will only power you.

    Windfall => Spider-Man, Forsaken => Batman, Kahlt => Hulk
  • That does sound like it would fit but you have to be careful with how much you buff kahlt since absorb is so easy to use. I see a lot of kahlt users in CT and most of them are quite good. In my opinion they are the second toughest matchup. I have even seen more extreme kahlt players than extreme forsaken players. If kahlt gets a huge buff now then they will probably replace forsaken as the most frustrating matchup.
  • As for Kahlt's attack style and concept, Absorb should not JUST allow you to take hits; It should also let you store/channel the taken damage for a counter attack, making it as *"more damage you take, the more damage you will unleash to the opponent.
    Windfall => Spider-Man, Forsaken => Batman, Kahlt => Hulk

    This may be a good option for less play-hard folks, but yea I fought against a few Kahlt where I couldn't get past their defenses. Gold chaining and double hit attacks didn't even work on those Absolvers, and guard breakers can be easily dodged. But those plays are on a different level of play-hard.

    What if the Absorb just let you take less ghost dmg. Like the damage taken as half the damage in ghost hp?
  • edited November 2017
    I'm currently a mid-level forsaken player, so I can't really say much, but I'll comment with assumptions based on what people have said.

    I guess less play-hard people are the ones having problems, aren't they? and I can imagine they're the majority including me.

    If player-skill is the problem, maybe Kahlt's talent/ability should be more punishing with much greater return, similar to Parry. For example, we could make Absorb so that the user
    is temporarily unable to dodge during and for a few frames after the ability, and add something like Rage Mode (short duration) that will be available after Absorbing for a certain amount, which gives them immunity to Stun caused by parry and that ability, but makes them unable to block or dodge.

    This way, those casual people and hardcore people can play on the same level, and people of other classes will be able to break through their defense rather easily.
  • I don't understand what you mean.

    Either way, just played against a strong Kahlt, and holy f*ck...I can't even be angry. Was barely able to win 2 rounds out of 6. He absorbed more often than he blocked, and breaks me out of my gold chain. As if he had a parry buffer, but just used a fast light hit directly after absorbing.

    Um how and why would you try and bring the casual and hardcore people together? We're already separated by a hidden ranking system.
  • I dont think this Rage Mode would be a good idea, it would just encourage people to spam attacks during that time, and even if they cant dodge or block they can still use moves with dodge properties. I also disagree that more punish with greater return is right way to go for absorb. The biggest strength of absorb is the frame advantage, you can almost immediately attack after absorbing, even before the attack-animation of the enemy finishes, that way kahlts can interrupt enemy chains and start their own at almost any point.
    There were times where i pressed absorb as a reflex when the enemy started a guardbreaking attack and i could still dodge with Body Blow, which I was using right after I pressed absorb, thats just how fast you can use your own attacks after absorb.
    It does seem that newer players have the most problems with absorb so I think reducing the risk and the reward instead would be better. Reducing the ghost health but also the stamina gain to balance it out would probably make absorb more beginner friendly.
  • I think Khalt is in an okay place right now; it's just hard to tell because of how much better Forsaken is than everything else. I'd rather the stacking defense buff be removed and a more active part of the move get buffed, but I think it's better than windfall or stagger after a certain point of skill level (once people understand mixups, absorb cancelling, and have memorized their own decks).
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